Speaker 1:
You're listening to The Travel Podcast. Travel Podcast. Today's most exciting travel destinations brought to you by people with a real passion for travel. Great holiday ideas, real reviews, practical advice and all the best deals in one simple podcast. The Travel Podcast. Now, here is your host, Steve Witt.

Steve:
Hey everyone, and welcome to The Travel Podcast, where we aim to inspire you with some brilliant news, views and behind-the-scenes look at some of the most amazing destinations in the world. I'm Steve Witt, co-founder of one of the UK's biggest travel companies, and always I'm joined by a team of travel experts who live and breathe travel every single day. They work in travel, they're travel experts, most importantly they are passionate about traveling the world. And today, I'm joined by Jules. Welcome Jules.

Jules:
Thank you. Hello.

Steve:
And also today, we have a special guest who we'll come to in a moment, but today we're also joined by a live studio audience dotted around the UK, a virtual studio audience, I should say. So, welcome to everyone who is on the line and joining us. You can't hear them but they are there, and they're poised ready to ask questions about today's podcast. So guys, if you are one of our studio audience, do feel free to ask questions as we go, we'll come to those in due course.

Steve:
Now, today, I'm super excited about today's podcast because we always get to travel the world to some amazing destinations, but this is one of my favorites. I may have said that before but this genuinely is because I went to this location for my 30th birthday, which you might want to make a note of this Jules, it's the fourth of October, just to put it into context. My 30th birthday was only a couple of years ago as well, just so you know.

Jules:
Of course.

Steve:
And I went here, and it was the most memorable experience ever. So, today, we are off to Antigua and Barbuda, I'm never sure if I'm saying that one right, we'll come to that in a second, but we are joined by Joel. Joel, hopefully you are there and joining us.

Joel:
Hi Steve. Thank you very much for that warm introduction.

Steve:
You are welcome. So, just for context for everyone, you are our resident expert today. Just for everyone who hasn't met you before, a quick bio about yourself, where you're from and what makes you such an expert?

Joel:
Well, I'm actually from Antigua itself, so I moved to the UK 11 years ago. I came for two years, don't know where the time went, and I'm not working with the tourist board in London promoting Antigua throughout the UK and Europe. So, I guess the job really is to persuade people to go there on their holiday. Not really a hard job is it, Steve? Considering you've been [inaudible 00:02:44].

Steve:
Well, I would say not a hard job, it's not much convincing. Certainly, I would go back in a heartbeat. Jules, you've never been, have you?

Jules:
No. I've not been fortunate enough to get to that island specifically. I've been to Dominican Republic, but that's my entire Caribbean ...

Steve:
Experience.

Jules:
... experience. I'm very excited to hear today from Joel all about Antigua and Barbuda.

Steve:
So, for the guys who are our virtual studio audience, if you could type in and let us know if you've been before, that would just help us with questions. But Joel, now, we want to take people on a bit of a virtual tour of the island. So, I'm going to pitch in with loads of questions because I could rave about it all day long. Just for anyone who's not been, we obviously know it's the Caribbean, but just to put it into context, where abouts in the Caribbean? What can you say to help people position it?

Joel:
We say we're in the heart of the Caribbean, because Antigua is one of the first islands you meet coming in from the Atlantic Ocean. It is quite centrally located in the Leeward Islands, and really provides that twin centering opportunity. So, even customers who are going on to smaller islands, like British Virgin Islands, Saint Bart's, Antigua is the hub that they come into. It's a very small island, it's not as big as people think it is. It's quite popular. But in realistically, it's only 11 miles by 14. So, when you come, Steve, next time, you rent a car, stop at the red light, we know you're a tourist visiting.

Steve:
Now, you say hire a car, now, am I correct in saying, and it may have changed since I went a couple of years ago, there's no sign posts, is there?

Joel:
There is a few but if they're followed. It's an island joke, but there are a few, legally.

Steve:
Oh, okay. So, now, I went as, I actually did a water sports holiday, and we'll talk more about water sports in a bit, but you're either going to go for a holiday, fly and flop type holiday, or you could go on a cruise, couldn't you? It's a very Popular cruising destination.

Joel:
During the winter months, from November until about the end of May, we get a few cruise ships coming into Saint John's and into the English and Falmouth harbors, definitely. It's a good way to taste Antigua through the cruise. You get one day, and then people come back for a holiday after.

Steve:
Excellent. Now, we'll talk more about the cruising in a bit because you're going to end up on a certain part of the island, probably, if you go cruising. Let's say you're flying from the UK, now obviously this podcast goes out all over the world, but flying from the UK, typical flight times?

Joel:
Seven and a half, eight hours, it depends on the [inaudible 00:05:16], so it's a good way to get there. In the winter months it's a bit shorter due to the tailwinds, so six and a half, seven, so a bit like mid-haul instead of long-haul, we like to say.

Steve:
Brilliant. And is that a direct flight?

Joel:
All direct flights from Gatwick, 11 flights a week.

Steve:
Wow. Amazing. So, you fly in and, I mean, it's such a warm reception when you get to Antigua. You're going to arrive at the airport, great little airport, and then head off to where you're going to be staying. Now, when I arrived, I got a taxi to the hotel I was staying in, very interesting taxi experience and I don't know if it's changed since I was there. But getting around the island, what's the best way of doing that when you arrive, Joel?

Joel:
People get a taxi, that's normally the most popular option because there's no bus services from the VC Bird International Airport. As I said before, it's only 11 by 14 miles, so everywhere is within 30 minutes, so it's quite a scenic drive, so it's a nice way to get your first day going in the sun.

Steve:
What's the best time of year to be going?

Joel:
Well, we're an all-year round destination. It depends on what you're looking for. If you just want to beach and flop, you can come between November and May. But if you want to come when things are happening, like festivals and carnival, you come during the summer months, so June, July, August. So, it depends on what the customer is looking for.

Steve:
I mean, Antigua's very well known for sailing, that's one of the great things, you mentioned festivals there, do a lot of people come for those activities as opposed to just the fly and flop type holidays?

Joel:
Yes. Antigua's one of the top five sailing destinations in the world. And it has built a reputation over the years hosting many regattas, classic boat shows, luxury yacht shows, the Antigua race week every April. And the good thing is, you don't have to be a sailor to partake. There's so many activities and beach parties and concerts happening during that time, so the spectators element of it is really good. So, if you're there on your holiday next time, do come out during Antigua sailing week and you can go out every night, see the boats, attend events and you just enjoy it as if you were sailing on a boat.

Steve:
And it is an absolutely fantastic festination for water sports as well, isn't it? I went there for windsurfing, that's my passion, catamaran sailing, but it is such a great location, isn't it?

Joel:
It is absolutely fantastic. And what a lot of people don't know about Antigua and Barbuda, we're actually a collection of 26 offshore islands, so you can kit surf over to Green Island, or you can take a catamaran over to Barbuda, so you really get a diverse experience when you come out there on a holiday, not just being on the beach every day.

Jules:
Brilliant. I actually learned to sail last summer in Sand Banks, so is it any good for ... I wouldn't say I was really up there yet for regattas, but is it a good place to go even if you're a beginner for the water sports?

Joel:
Absolutely. There are various resorts on Antigua that actually cater for non sailors who want to leave with a skill in and around the east coast in Nonsuch Bay where we have the Atlantic tides come in. They do a lot of sailing schools there as well with kids as well, so it's a really good way, people love it because then they grow up, they come back as teenagers, and then they come back with their families later in life, so it's a nice thing to get attracted to when you're there.

Steve:
So, we're going to talk more ...

Jules:
Fantastic. I wouldn't have ...

Steve:
Go on. Go Jules. Ladies first, Jules.

Jules:
I was just going to say, I wouldn't have thought of it initially as such a family destination. It really springs into my mind as a place to go on a honeymoon, so yeah, you've really given me great insights there, Joel. There's more to Antigua that ...

Joel:
Great. I'll see you outside on a boat.

Steve:
And there's a number of companies who use Antigua as a base for sailing holidays, flotilla-type holidays, isn't there?

Joel:
Excellent. That is through the British Virgin Islands. They all come through Antigua because we have the history as well. We also have the anchorages all around the island, which is beautiful, it goes back to the 1800's century, so Antigua is really fortunate and blessed to have that.

Steve:
So, for anyone, let's say you're going to the Caribbean, each Caribbean island has its own style, its own culture, its own look and feel. For anyone who's never been to Antigua, how would you describe the island to paint a mental picture for people?

Joel:
I would say Antigua is your authentic Caribbean. It's not over-developed, it's still very low-rise buildings, your rooms in your resorts are bungalows on the beach, you walk off straight into the sea. Not over-populated, just about 100,000 people on the island, so no matter where you are you feel like you're having the beach to yourself, there's no building taller than a palm tree, it's like opening on a crayon book. Walk into Saint John's, every building is a different color. When you think of the Caribbean, you think of white sand, turquoise water and palm trees. Antigua ticks all those boxes for you.

Jules:
You've got a few beaches haven't you, Joel?

Joel:
Oh, hundreds. We can name one after you, Jules.

Jules:
Oh, thank you.

Steve:
Didn't I see there's literally a beach for every single day of the year?

Joel:
We've lost count, so we just say 365, one for every day of the year. But that's the beauty of Antigua. You can take a boat to get to some of them, you can hike in the mornings to get to some of them, and some will be outside your resort, so you're spoiled for choice.

Steve:
And all the beaches are public, so literally you can walk on any, is that right?

Joel:
That is correct. All beaches are public, but that's the nice part about it because you could be staying on the north coast of the island but you could be renting a car and drive to the south coast with your picnic basket, some local will [inaudible 00:10:48] there, and just go on the beach for the afternoon, relax there.

Jules:
Sorry, I was just going to ask Joel if he had a favorite beach?

Joel:
I'll be biased, but the village that I'm from in Antigua is called Five Islands Village, and it has three resorts and also a lovely beach called Galley Bay. And so, growing up as a child in Antigua, it's literally 15 minutes walk from my house, that was a typical bank holiday weekend. You walk to the beach, spend your entire day, you come back at sunset, so it's grown on me now.

Steve:
And the beaches are so amazing. I always remember the color of the sea. It is that picture perfect, that postcard color sea, isn't it?

Joel:
Yes. Your phones, no matter how many pixels you have, don't do it justice. You have to come and see it for yourself. It's absolutely stunning and beautiful.

Steve:
Now, I went in October and I remember windsurfing, and I was sailing along thinking, "Wow, this is so hot. I need to jump into the ocean to cool off." And I jumped into this picture perfect ocean, and I had to get out again because the water was too hot, it was too warm. The most amazing experience. So much to see and do on such a small island. Now, we're going to talk about some of the places you can go, what might be a good starting point, Joel, for anyone who's never been before looking to go and see the sights, you've got to start somewhere, where would you start?

Joel:
I would start in English Harbor on the south coast of Antigua. That's the rich history round there, it is a UNESCO World Heritage Site, you get to know about where Antigua was before, where is it going now, and it's just fantastic. There's walking trails, museums, ancient forts, just really a fantastic introduction to the island.

Steve:
So, a little bit sort of Pirates of the Caribbean-esque?

Joel:
Yes. It was the former base of British Navy as well, so customers who are coming from the UK, for example, can really get in touch with a bit of history and the connection between Antigua and Great Britain.

Steve:
And you can walk around, you can see the sights, there's museums there you can go into.

Joel:
Yeah, it's like an old town, you can walk around. There's about two dozen restaurants and cafes, you can sit, have a nice pinot grigio overlooking the mega yachts in the harbor, and then you can just have a fantastic afternoon, have some lunch, and then you head back to your resort in the evening.

Steve:
And it is such a chilled out place to go, it's very relaxed, it is picture perfect. So, is that a day activity? Or just pop in and see it? What would you recommend?

Joel:
You could make it a day activity because there's so much to do around there. Instead of just rushing, you come and you wind down, you have a good time. If you go on a Sunday, for example, you can do that in the day, and then in the evening you can go to Shirley Heights, for example, where you can watch the sunset and enjoy barbecue. You enjoy flamey grills, meats, steaks, lobsters, reggae bands, steel bands, it's fantastic, and it goes until 10PM. So, you can make it a full day, or short as possible.

Jules:
You're making us hungry, Joel.

Steve:
So, one of the things I did, I took the opportunity to take a tour of the island, I literally just hired a taxi for the day. Taxi and the driver, and said, "Take me around, see the sights." Is that something that you'd recommend?

Joel:
Highly recommend because you can get it tailored to your needs. And the taxi drivers are very passionate about what they do, it's their bread and butter, they love it, so you actually do get a more authentic experience than going on a scheduled tour where you never know, they might drop you off at their mom's for a cup of tea, or a shot of rum. But you get the real experience, off the beaten track, places that you wouldn't have read in a brochure or on a website, and it's a real way to get to know Antigua. As I said, we're only 100,000 population, everybody knows everybody, it's safe [inaudible 00:14:26] so that, to me, is the way I would do it if I am going back on a holiday.

Steve:
I would do that again in a heartbeat. I think you could pretty much pick any taxi driver, they're all the friendliest people in the world and all have the ability to talk.

Joel:
And they've been doing it for years and years, and they get people who come back and request the same driver for the next time, they come and recommend it to all their friends, they definitely love what they do.

Steve:
Amazing. So, English Harbor, Shirley Heights, where else would you head to next?

Joel:
I would probably head over to Saint John's, that's the capital city of Antigua. Couple of streets, duty free shopping, just really a nice day out. Have some local food as well. You can try out the local goat stew and dumplings from the street vendors, and then just have a look at what [inaudible 00:15:11]. You might find some guys on the corner playing dominoes. Or just wonder in the streets. There's a cathedral there, Saint John's cathedral, and you also have a museum in Saint John's as well. It's just fantastic to spend a couple of hours.

Steve:
Now, am I right in saying this is where the cruise ships come in to, isn't it?

Joel:
That's where the cruise ships do come in to Saint John's.

Steve:
So, you can literally walk right to the dock to see where the cruise ships come in.

Joel:
Correct.

Steve:
And that's the first couple of streets where people would be coming into if they got off the cruise ship are amazing shops. You've got jewelry shops, it's the nice, bright colors, you've got all the restaurants and everything.

Joel:
And the rum shops.

Steve:
Oh, and the rum shops, of course. But from there, as you walk a little bit further out of that center part of town, it gets a little bit more authentic, doesn't it?

Joel:
It does, yes. If you go to the right, you go to the museum and the cathedral. If you go to the left, you reach the Saint John's public markets and craft markets, and just seeing the locals on their everyday life, working, selling them side of the street, selling authentic Antigua souvenirs, or just having a nice, getting fantastic photos of the street art. Antigua, as I said, it's very colorful, every building's a different color, so really good for people who are into photography and that sort of things. Very, very, very good spot to be.

Jules:
Fantastic. Now Joel, you mentioned the food and you got me hungry for food, and I've done a bit of research on the food as it is my favorite subject. So, I would like to know, Joel, forgive my pronunciation, I think it's fungee?

Joel:
Fungee, yes.

Jules:
Can I ask what it is?

Joel:
So, it's basically a bit like polenta. It's cornmeal cooked with fresh herbs and okra, and that is served normally with a fish, so whether it's steamed fish or salted cod. And it's something like a ritual in Antigua, you have that every time you want to feel at home. So, even me being an Antiguan away, if I want to feel a bit of Antigua in Essex, I make that for myself.

Jules:
You can't order that on a takeaway in Essex, no?

Joel:
No, it's not on Deliveroo.

Jules:
Not on Deliveroo. And another thing that I saw, this sounds absolutely delicious, ducana?

Joel:
Ducana. So, every Easter, a traditional Good Friday dish is called ducana. So, basically, it's a combination of grated coconuts mixed with flour, water, spices, and you can make it with raisins or no raisins, that a big debate, and you basically knead it. And it's cooked in a banana leaf and steamed in water, and you could have it with anything that has a sauce base, stewed chicken, salted cod, stewed fish. Every Good Friday, every house in Antigua is cooking that. There's no coconuts left at the market.

Jules:
And finally on the food, I've heard about the Antigua black pineapple?

Joel:
Oh yes. Antigua is one of the driest islands in the Caribbean because of its location. It doesn't get a lot of rain because it doesn't have mountains to attract the clouds and it's not a volcanic island. So, because of that, the soil is quite dense. So, growing pineapples takes about 18 months, so they're not as huge as the ones you get when you get them from the major plantations, the ones in Antigua are very small and the skin is dark in color. But because of that, it's condensed and it's so sweet. You grab a bit of the sweet pineapple, it just runs down your mouth, delicious, and it's called the Antigua black pineapple, one of the sweetest pineapples you'll ever have in the world.

Jules:
Amazing. Oh, we shouldn't have done this before lunch, Joel.

Steve:
So, talking of food, now, we went to Saint John's and enjoyed it so much we decided to go back for an evening meal. So, we got a taxi back to the restaurant in the center of town, recommended by a local, and while we were there we were sat on the table next to Viv Richards which, Jules, you're looking a little bit blank there. No?

Jules:
Sorry.

Steve:
Shame on you.

Jules:
I've got nothing.

Steve:
Now, I was with my dad, so made the entire holiday for my dad. Now, why is that so important, John?

Joel:
So, Viv Richards is our national hero and a living legend. He was the pioneer of the West Indies cricket team in their heyday when they were playing matches against South Africa, New Zealand, India, Britain, sorry guys, but they were very, very extraordinary and he's really a built a pioneer and a fantastic reputation. Today in Antigua, just like yourself, we get many cricket fans that come over just to see him, we have a stadium that is named after him, it features a museum as well for Sir Viv Richards. There's a street in Antigua called Sir Viv Richards Street, which has his home where he was brought up with his mom and his brothers, so he's definitely a big tourist attraction for us.

Joel:
I mean, when Sir Viv Richards comes to the UK for work or on his own personal time, you'd be amazed of how many people know him here. He's like a local celebrity, and his reputation is just fantastic. And cricket lovers, for Antigua, it is so iconic for such a small island to have such a fantastic cricketer in the world of cricketers.

Jules:
Fantastic.

Steve:
So, if you're not into sailing, you can go and talk to anyone about cricket and they'll all talk to you about cricket.

Joel:
It is our national sport, every village has a cricket field, you'll see kids playing randomly, and cricket matches that happen throughout the year attract thousands and thousands of people that come just for the cricket atmosphere.

Jules:
Are you any good, Joel?

Joel:
Not anymore. I've been in the UK too long.

Jules:
We've got cricket here. You can join some team over here.

Joel:
It's not as warm.

Jules:
I can't help you there.

Steve:
So, Viv Richards, a celebrity in his own right, living legend, but also ... now, I'm right in saying that Antigua's become a bit of a celebrity hotspot, hasn't it?

Joel:
Oh yes. Because of the friendliness of the people, people do not feel bothered. The islanders very much respectful of who comes, they treat you like family, so a lot of celebrities have called Antigua their home. So, they've come, build their own homes, come on multiple holidays, bring their families, go sailing themselves, depending from who they are, from the US, from Italy, from the UK, and they really do love it. They love that sort of experience where it's very much they can be on the beach, no paparazzi, no one is troubling them and they're just having the best holiday of their life. They want to escape that. Antigua is like their escape.

Steve:
Let's try you with some of these names, Jules, you might recognize these more than cricketers. Cameron Diaz apparently loves Antigua.

Joel:
Oh yes, she does. She's been a few times, had a villa.

Steve:
Nicole ...

Jules:
Have you met her, Joel?

Steve:
Nicole Scherzinger? I haven't said that right.

Joel:
Yeah. She's been before, she did some filming out there as well for us.

Steve:
Eric Clapton.

Joel:
Yes. Sir Eric Clapton, he actually calls Antigua his second home. He actually built a rehabilitation center there [inaudible 00:22:25] as well, and he has an auction for his guitars. And you can see it from a distance, people actually come and visit his home. It's really, really his getaway spot when he wants to just get away and he's been there for years, since I was a little boy he's been in Antigua.

Steve:
Brilliant. Paul McCartney.

Joel:
Yes, absolutely. Another favorite for luxury hotels.

Steve:
Clearly a place for musicians because Mariah Carey, Mary J Blige, Charlotte Church all on the list of people who go.

Joel:
When you find a good spot, you share it with your close friends.

Steve:
And then, the one that's possibly not so good, Piers Morgan.

Joel:
Yeah, he loves it as well. And also Robert DeNiro, he's come out there a few times as well for a holiday. I've actually been in a restaurant and Robert DeNiro was on the next table to me having dinner in the local fish restaurant, just like how were in lunch and you say Sir Viv Richards. So, you never know what's going to happen when you're in Antigua. Never know.

Steve:
Amazing. We've talked cricket, we've talked celebrities, we know where we go if we're going cruising. What else can we do on the island?

Joel:
Antigua, you can always come around for if you want to do authentic foodie tours. So, for example, we have classes like cooking with rum, so you can get into a local home and you learn how to cook. Nicole's Table, she's a very popular one, that's quite popular. To celebrate our independence we do a big food festival as well in November, so fantastic local streets, amongst the streets, at the Sir Vivian Richards Cricket Stadium, and just really doing a nice foodie trail. Very sort of gastronomic experience. A lot of people don't connect the Caribbean with that, and that is something that we think people should do more when they come, learn about spices that we use, tour the hot sauce factory, learn how to make rum, that sort of experience I try to encourage as much people when they come to set into their itinerary in Antigua. Even just the one day. You leave with something, a good skill.

Jules:
And you've also got some fantastic diving spots. Sorry, I know we talked about water sports, but diving is another one of my passions. And I've seen that the amount of coral that you have and the different species that you can come into contact with and the turtles. Are you a diver, Joel?

Joel:
I'm not a diver. Quite funny, Antiguans do not like to swim below deep water. They swim in the shallow bit. But yes, you're correct, on the south coast we've got K3, which is a two-mile reef, very popular. Also on Barbuda, Barbuda's knows to have hundreds of shipwrecks, which is fantastic for diving, because the island itself is below sea level, so a lot of shipwrecks sank there back in the days when they used to have the 18th century boats coming in, and that has created a lot of diving spots for people looking for that sort of experience as well. And even on Antigua, there are a few shipwrecks around Antigua.

Joel:
But stunning reefs. There's an area called Stingray City, it's a reef off a village called Seatons. There's the home of hundreds of stingrays, so even the shallow snorkeling there you see stingrays in the wild. Fantastic experience.

Jules:
Definitely. That is fantastic. And you've got quite a lot of different wildlife that you can spot all around Antigua. I see wild deer and things like that. Do you have any favorite wildlife hotspots?

Joel:
Yes, you can go to the donkey sanctuary. That is a place for the donkeys who are stray and don't have anywhere, not owners, anyone to look after them. So, it's not a money-making organization, but they keep them there. And you can just go there with a brush, spend a couple of hours, pat them, let them feel at home, and it's really a nice, cool spot there. I try to go to it once a year to see how they're doing and it's really nice, because growing up these donkeys were part of our livelihood growing up in Antigua, and these donkeys can be used for fantastic. They're very friendly as well. Good for kids, the kids love them as well.

Steve:
So, before we head on over to Barbuda, there's such a choice of places to stay in Antigua as well, isn't there? What can you tell us about the diverse nature of the hotels? Or how would you choose where to stay on the island because there's plenty of choice.

Joel:
Plenty of choice. Firstly, you have to decide who you're coming with because we have adults only and we've got family resorts. We've got villas, we've got self-catering, we've got three-star, we've got the mega expensive that Mariah Carey stays at. So, Antigua, [inaudible 00:26:55] you decide.

Joel:
Again, because of the size of the island, anywhere you are on the island doesn't really make much of a different because you're no more than 10, 15 minutes from a beach regardless of where you are. And so, on the east coast, for example, because that is facing the Atlantic sea, people are into kite surfing, windsurfing normally stay at Nonsuch Bay because you get the nice winds coming that way and you can do those sort of activities at that resort. If you want something a bit more exclusive you can stay at [inaudible 00:27:24] Bay, which is actually a hotel on a little island off Antigua. And so, it's five-star luxury, very exclusive.

Joel:
But if you want something very colonial style on Antigua, hotels like Blue Waters Resort, Hermitage Bay, Coco's all face the Caribbean Sea and are made up of bungalows on the beach or on the hill. Fantastic views. You will not get any sort of massive resorts on Antigua. They're all locally-owned, fantastically designed, very in the natural flora and fauna and just gives you that sort of feeling like, "I have arrived in the Caribbean."

Jules:
That's brilliant. What's your sort of preferred type of accommodation? Do you like the more authentic style or the more luxury?

Joel:
Something with a bit of character, so a hotel like the Inn at English Harbor, which is located just outside of Nelson's Dockyard, this is my style. 28 rooms, on the beach, and on the right is an old history fort, on the left is a beautiful bay, and you just feel like you're in the midst of history and it has so much character, it speaks for itself. That is my style.

Steve:
And do people tend to go all-inclusive type holidays in Antigua? Or are they bed and breakfast, and then go out for meals? Or is it a mixture?

Joel:
We get a very big mix of that. So, we normally get the all-inclusive for the first timers who just think they're booking another Caribbean holiday, and when they come and they realize how easy it is to get around, how friendly the people are, the next holiday, "We come back and just do self-catering." Get a villa or an apartment in English Harbor. And renting a car is quite easy, we drive on the same side of the road like people here in England, so it's quite easy to just jump in the car, run to the supermarket, grab your food and just go round the beaches. You can map yourself, you can come for a whole year, be on a beach a day.

Steve:
Amazing. So, I went for a week, is that normal? Do people tend to go for longer? What's your experience?

Joel:
Longer. We get average 10 to 14 nights, even 21 nights. People love it for that sort of escape. They feel after they've left Antigua that it's given them their mind back, and people are, we've found, are coming for longer and longer. They're doing a lot of twin centering as well. Being the hub of the northern Caribbean, you can do a week in Antigua and then do a week somewhere else.

Steve:
So, somewhere else could be Barbuda, I'm guessing?

Joel:
That's correct.

Steve:
I'd never considered that before I went, obviously would consider it now, how would I get from one to the other?

Joel:
You can do Barbuda three diff ways. Depends on your mood and what you want to spend. You can do the flight, that takes the shortest, 15 minutes from Antigua airport straight into Barbuda. And because we are the same country, there is no border controls or anything. So, you land on the plane on an airport that is about two meters big, and you're out.

Joel:
You can do the catamaran, which is like a day trip that takes you from the Saint John's Harbor. Sail your course to Barbuda leisurely, rum punch, music, food, dancing, relaxing on the nets, and it sails you round the whole island of Barbuda and you spend a day, and you head back to Antigua in the afternoon.

Joel:
Or you can do it my style, you can just hop on the local ferry and you can just go over with the locals, because people live on Barbuda, work in Antigua, and vice versa. So, you can just jump on that in the morning, head over to Barbuda with your luggage and spend a couple of nights there and do that on the return. You get the ferry straight from the Saint John's dock and it's really quite a nice way to get to see Barbuda.

Steve:
And what's different about Barbuda? Is it different culture? Different feeling? Is it just a smaller version of Antigua? How do you describe it?

Joel:
We say we are blessed because we have two paradises instead of just one. Barbuda is like your Robin Crusoe version of Antigua. It's 62 square miles, Antigua's 108 square miles. Antigua's a population of 100,000, Barbuda has a population of just about 1,000. Antigua has white sand beaches, Barbuda has pink sand beaches. So, it's very, very different, and it just really compliments each other, it doesn't compete with each other. We're truly lucky to have that experience. Even if you don't want to stay on Barbuda, you come into Antigua for a seven-day holiday, hop on the catamaran, you get to go into the local village of Cartington, and you enjoy some local Barbuda seafood.

Jules:
Delicious. Joel, is there any rivalry between the two islands?

Joel:
Friendly rivalry. We all get it.

Jules:
Cricket matches? Do you have an Antigua versus Barbuda cricket match?

Joel:
No, because we have to go as one country. We have Antigua versus other islands in the Caribbean cricket matches, so we are one country.

Steve:
So, in terms of if you want to go to Barbuda, which sounds amazing, I don't know why I haven't done it yet, it's now on my list, choice of accommodation? Is there choice? It doesn't sound very big [crosstalk 00:32:15]

Joel:
There's luxury resorts, or you can do the simple apartments. Because it's such a small island and such a low population, people tend to normally do it on the sort of just going, grab and apartment, and you can just wonder round the streets on your own or with a local tour guide while you're there. There's a local Barbuda tourist office located right in the airport to provide you with maps and taxi drivers, and anything you need to make your holiday there much better.

Joel:
But yeah, there's hotels, The Barbuda Belle, The Barbuda Cottages, and there's new news of developments happening there all the time, so it just depends when they'll open. But it's definitely becoming more popular. But at the same time, Barbuda is not a place what's in our vision to be over-crowded, so we keep it as a secret, it's very small, very authentic. The biggest hotel on Barbuda has nine rooms.

Steve:
Oh wow.

Jules:
Nine rooms?

Joel:
And that's the biggest.

Steve:
So, if you're staying in Antigua and going across for a day trip, can you take a car with you?

Joel:
No, you can't do the car, unfortunately, you'd have to leave your car in Antigua. But you can just go for the day and come back on the passenger ferry.

Jules:
How long is the local ferry, Joel?

Joel:
It's about an hour and 45 minutes, or 15 minutes if you fly.

Steve:
So, someone looking to go on holiday, they'd love to do a twin center, going to spend some time in Antigua, then head across to Barbuda, how long would you spend in both?

Joel:
I would do seven nights in Antigua. You can do seven nights in the south coast of Antigua, somewhere like Carlisle Bay or Curtain Bluff. Then you can go down to English Harbor in Antigua, visit Saint John's, do a food tour, do a catamaran trip, then head to Barbuda for your last three nights. On your way back, you can transfer to the airport and you connect on your flight back to where you came from. That, to me, is my perfect twin center [inaudible 00:33:59] for Antigua and Barbuda.

Jules:
How does Barbuda get its pink sand?

Joel:
It's from the coral. The coral breaks up into very small particles and it washes ashore, so it mixes with the white sand and when the sun hits that it glows a light pink, and it's about 17 miles of unbroken beach. It's breathtaking.

Jules:
Sounds incredible. And the diving as well would be amazing round there with all that coral.

Joel:
Yes. Very good reviews.

Steve:
Popular for British tourists, is it popular for the Americans as well?

Joel:
Yes. We get Americans, but Americans do come for short weekends. The British are the tourists that comes for the longer stays. And a lot of our hotels are British-owned, so there is a connection there as well. And we get a lot of British people who are our biggest repeaters. About 50% of Antigua tourism is repeat business. We say we must be doing something right.

Jules:
Definitely. And you've got the picture postcards as well.

Steve:
So, loads of things you could be doing on the islands, it sounds amazing, we can't talk about them all. But on your website, which is VisitAntiguaBarbuda.com, you've got a brilliant tool for planning a trip, haven't you?

Joel:
Yes, and itinerary based, so you can just select different elements and pull your itinerary together, so you can get your ideas and your inspiration because we do encourage you to go out. Even if you're on an all-inclusive hotel, get out to see Antigua. We want you to enjoy the people, enjoy the local food, enjoy the history and the culture, and it gives you some really, really good ideas on what to do.

Steve:
Now, I would advocate that absolutely because you could literally just fly and flop, but you'd be wasting such an opportunity, wouldn't you? There's so much cool things to do in a very relaxed way. It's not going to be stressy going out and visiting all these places.

Joel:
No.

Steve:
Possibly one of the most relaxed holidays ever.

Joel:
And on the website, we also have the Antigua and Barbuda Beach Bar Trail. So, it's a bit like using a dating app, it picks up where you are and tells you all the little local beach bars around you, and things that you won't really know about or you would have heard of before. And it's quirky, it's funny, the staff there are locals, they own it, they have a passion for it, and you really do leave with some good memories.

Steve:
Amazing. So, we're getting near the end of the podcast. Guys in the virtual studio audience, if you've got any questions, do feel free to type them in before it's too late. Jules, any sort of thoughts? You've never been before, what are you thinking right now having heard what Joel's got to say?

Jules:
So, it's totally changed my original opinion of a honeymoon destination of just couples swanning along beaches. So yeah, I'm really excited to put together one of those itineraries on his fabulous website and get going. [inaudible 00:36:53] families, I'm really impressed, Joel. I really didn't think it had so much to offer.

Joel:
It does, and families of all ages can go zip lining in the rainforest, swim with stingrays, ATV tours. It really does offer a really good mix for people who are wanting that true, authentic Caribbean holiday in Antigua and Barbuda.

Steve:
It's difficult to really describe. Go and look at photos, we'll put photos on the website and everything but, until you've been, it's really difficult to really get that true feeling of what it's like, that authentic without being too rustic, but also with the friendly atmosphere, you've got really something for everyone. The fact that celebrities, you've even got the likes of Oprah Winfrey, they don't come much richer than people like Oprah Winfrey, choosing to go to Antigua says it all.

Joel:
Yes. I agree with that. And it obviously resonates with people mind. We said memories make a best souvenir, and I think that's what Antigua and Barbuda does to people.

Steve:
And just to add to that, just because rich and famous people got there does not mean it's a very expensive place to go.

Joel:
No. It just means that we attract all calibers of people, from people who just want to Airbnb on the beach, very small, very boutique, or people who just want to go to the super high-end luxury villas. Very much caters to everyone's needs, everyone's bucket list. And, yeah, it's fantastic for a group of friends, honeymoons, families, or even solo travelers. It's the perfect place to meet new friends as well.

Steve:
Fantastic. So, looking forward to 2021. Obviously April you said is Sailing Week, what other sort of festivals might there be to try and plan your diaries around?

Joel:
We usually have our cricket international matches in February. We've got a classic yacht regatta as well, and Sailing Week in April. In June is romance month, so we have lots of novel readings and events happening on the beach, twilight dinners and movies on the beach, very romantic atmosphere. July, August is our carnival celebrations, so really good for people who want to get into the streets, watch parades, colorful costumes. In October we have more cricket matches as well. We celebrate independence from Great Britain on the first of November every year, and that has a week of celebrations in November, it ends with a national food festival in the streets at Sir Viv Richard Cricket Stadium. That's a fantastic time as well, you see all the locals cooking the food on the street, food and just sampling all the local delicacies. Delicious, absolutely delicious.

Joel:
So, always something happening throughout the year, but carnival and the sailing regatta is our biggest events. We're still a small island, so when we say big it's still 2,000 people, it's a lot for us. Cricket is probably our biggest following.

Jules:
I read, Joel, that the carnival in Antigua lasts 10 days.

Joel:
10 days, yes. [crosstalk 00:39:59] It's fantastic. Different parties, different events. You've got events in the day, events in the evening. You do need a holiday after a carnival holiday.

Jules:
And you've got a special costume you're wearing this year?

Joel:
I haven't chosen that yet, but I'd like to go back every year. I've been back 10 of the 11 years I've been here for carnival. All my friends look forward to me coming back and joining the party.

Steve:
And Jules is going to be going back for romance month, was it June?

Joel:
Yeah, June is romance month.

Steve:
Question in from Chris. Obviously, you've perked his interest with the rum, "Are there rum distillery tours you can do?"

Joel:
Yes. So, you can go to Saint John's, the Antigua rum is called English Harbor rum. And you can do rum tasting, you can try the five-year-old that's been barrelled in oak barrels, 10-year-old, 15-year-old, [inaudible 00:40:52] rum, the coconut rum, and you can do really, really good rum tasting. I don't know how you'll be when you walk out of there, but it's a fantastic, authentic experience [inaudible 00:41:02] any of the distilleries around.

Steve:
Amazing. So, I've learned a lot, even though I've been there before. I can't wait to go back. I'm probably going to do a twin center this time, I think, go and experience both islands. I want to see this pink sand. That does sound fantastic.

Joel:
Fantastic, yes.

Steve:
And I think I might even try and coincide it with carnival because that does sound pretty special.

Joel:
It is special. You don't have to do all 10 days. We excuse you if you can do nine.

Steve:
So Jules, what are you going to head back for? What's your number one thing that sounds most exciting?

Jules:
Food always, Steve, I don't know why you bother asking me. It's always food-based.

Steve:
Well, I have the benefit I can see you on webcam, so I can see your face every time food's mentioned.

Jules:
I mean, it sounds incredible. I say I like the diving, but I'd also like to eat the fish too, so it seems a bit mean but I might as well dive, see them all in their happy habitats and then get to the restaurant, so I get them fresh on my plate.

Joel:
Fantastic. Straight from the sea, straight on your plate.

Steve:
Brilliant. Joel, you have been amazing, we've learned lots. Just for anyone who'd like to check out this trip planner, where should they head to?

Joel:
VisitAntiguaBarbuda.com.

Steve:
Brilliant. We'll put a link to that in the show notes that go with this. Thank you for joining us today. You have been amazing. We're looking forward to heading out there.

Joel:
My pleasure.

Steve:
Thank you. So, if you've been listening today and you enjoyed the podcast, please head on over to iTunes or your favorite podcasting platform, leave us a five star review to help share it with everybody else, and we look forward to joining you on the next episode.

Speaker 1:
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